Communicate With Confidence with Aubrie Pohl

In this episode, Lunden and Aubrie share their most awkward communication moments, discuss how improving their communication has strengthened their relationships and careers, and reveal how to let go of the fear of judgment to speak with clarity and confidence.

Join our FREE Communicate with Confidence Masterclass on January 11: https://lifelikelunden.com/cwc

Timestamps to help you navigate this episode:
0:00 Intro
0:24 FREE Self Love & Sweat MONTHLY Calendar
4:41 Overcoming Insecurities in Communication
14:33 Navigating Confidence in Speaking
23:03 Letting Advice Take A Backseat
33:37 Overcoming Social Anxieties
43:13 The Challenge of Making Adult Friendships

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Chapters

• 0:00 Intro
• 0:24 FREE Self Love & Sweat MONTHLY Calendar
• 4:41 Overcoming Insecurities in Communication
• 14:33 Navigating Confidence in Speaking
• 23:03 Letting Advice Take A Backseat
• 33:37 Overcoming Social Anxieties
• 43:13 The Challenge of Making Adult Friendships

Transcript

Lunden Souza: 0:00

Welcome to Self Love and Sweat the podcast, the place where you'll get inspired to live your life unapologetically, embrace your perfect imperfections and do what sets your soul on fire. I'm your host, Lunden Souza. Hey, before we jump into this episode, I just want to make sure that you get all the free things possible, If you haven't already. You need to get your Self Love and Sweat free monthly life coaching calendar. Honestly, the way to experience deep change in your life is by doing small little things over time, and so that's what you'll find in this free calendar. You can get it by going to lifelikelunden com/calendar. Get yours for free and let's get into today's episode. Welcome back to the podcast. Today, we have Aubrie Pohl back on the podcast. You've been here, I think, like three or four Welcome back

Aubrie Pohl: 1:11

Thanks, I'm excited to be back. I'm really excited for this topic and it's fun to just converse with you. In a way, you're one of my really great friends and, yeah, let's dive into it.

Lunden Souza: 1:21

Yeah, I sent Aubrie over a bunch of random questions about this topic that we're going to discuss today. So that's kind of how today's episode is going to go. We're going to talk about questions that have to do with communication and confidence. Happy birthday, by the way. Me and Aubrie both just had our birthdays.

Aubrie Pohl: 1:43

Hey, hey, on to the next year.

Lunden Souza: 1:50

Both November birthdays. I feel like there's a lot of people that I love that were born in November. When I look at my November calendar, I'm like, oh shit, there's a lot of powerhouses that I love.

Aubrie Pohl: 1:56

Okay. So one time I heard that people with November birthdays basically you reap the autumn harvest at this time of year and because we're planting a lot in the spring and in the summer, we're growing the food and then in the autumn we get to reap the harvest. So people at this time of year tend to be more optimistic or cheerful because we're eating our labor that we did during the spring and summer and I thought that was a really cool, interesting fact, because you and I talk about being focused on silver linings, like relentlessly focused on the silver lining, and maybe that's also because of the time of year, because we're eating all the fruits that we've been growing for so long, metaphorically, and physically.

Lunden Souza: 2:40

I used to. I love that reframe or that visual because as a kid I didn't like having my birthday in November because it was always cold. I wanted a summer birthday because then you could do like fun birthday party things. But now as I get older I'm like yeah, I kind of like that. It goes like my birthday into the holidays, into like the end of the year, and it's kind of like the yeah, I don't know, I wanted to say period at the end of a sentence. That's not right because I know it's not a period. Maybe it's like the dot dot dot or it's just like that bookend at the end of a full year of like oh, yeah, okay, now I get to celebrate me, celebrate gratitude, be with family and then kind of get revved up for the next year. So, anyways, cheers to November birthdays. If your birthday is in November too, Send us a DM so we can celebrate you.

Lunden Souza: 3:31

Aubrie and I are hosting a free masterclass coming up in January, all about communicating with confidence, and if you want to sign up for that, you can do so. It's absolutely free. It's on January 11th. It'll be a two-hour free masterclass, all on this topic lifelikelunden. com/CWC. And so when Aubrie and I were coming up with questions or ideas for all the things to talk about. Today, a lot of what we're going to talk about is communicating with confidence, and moments that we've sucked or been embarrassed, or just our journey of communication land. So here we are. Here we are. What question should we start with? Aubrie, you want to pick?

Aubrie Pohl: 4:21

Oh my goodness. Well, when you brought up the one that was talking about the most awkward moment, I just thought it was such a good question because basically the question is asking what's the most awkward thing you've ever said in public and how did you recover? And I was thinking about it and I thought of a couple specific examples where I was in front of a group of people and I said something weird. But I remember, I strictly remember, years ago in my must've been mid twenties it was before I learned NLP but I remember making the decision in my mind that being embarrassed, the only way that you can be embarrassed, is if you think things are embarrassing. And so I had a little reframe switch in my mind that says I'm tired of being embarrassed. And at that time I was going to the gym a lot and so maybe I was embarrassed of being seen at the gym. You know, the observation of being perceived by other people could be embarrassing.

Aubrie Pohl: 5:09

And then I made that decision in my mind. That's like no, I will no longer be embarrassed, because I don't think things need to be embarrassing, because I have a couple moments, maybe in my younger days, where being embarrassed in front of a group of people would ruin my day, like I would spin on it for days too. And I remember having that feeling and sensation that I was like I don't want to be embarrassed anymore. And so now I speak in front of people all the time and you know, sometimes when you're talking you just you say things that you don't really intend on saying, because you miss a word or you skip a word or you say something different, and if it's embarrassing, it's only embarrassing because you're embarrassed, and so if you're not embarrassed, then things can't be embarrassing, and it was a good reframe for me. So I like that first question.

Lunden Souza: 5:59

Yeah, I like that one too, and you and I were talking about it a little bit before. We pressed record of, like, what was our most awkward thing you've ever said in public. And I said, and the way I feel about this now but I'm actually thinking of something that I could probably share for this answer to this question, that I didn't think of before, but it's like now I'm not sure if there's anything that I could say that would make me feel awkward or embarrassed, unless I maybe said something offensive to somebody that I really didn't mean to, that was unkind. Then maybe I would feel like, oh, like, yeah, awkward, embarrassed maybe is not the right word, but I'm just trying to think of like yeah, and I just recently watched the movie Inside Out too, where there's embarrassment and like some of the new emotions. But one of the things that I can think of when it comes to awkward and embarrassing is when I first started making videos for Runtastic in 2012. And I would redo the videos over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, and I would watch the video and then like, judge myself and think it was embarrassing or awkward or I said something weird.

Lunden Souza: 7:16

And I remember when I lived in San Clemente, uh, I lived with um, this guy, any, I lived with this guy, gavin. Super awesome dude, we were so close, so cool. Anyways, I remember I was in the living room recording a video for Rentastic for their heart rate tracking app. So back in the day they had this app where you could use the light on the back of your phone and then you would put your finger on it and it would like track your heart rate through some sort of light technology on your phone. And I think I redid like it was probably two sentences that I had to say. It was for like a Valentine's Day special, and I think I redid it at least 50 times at least.

Lunden Souza: 8:00

Right, and at some point Gavin comes out. He's like okay, you're done, you're done, it sounds great, you're done. He probably heard me say he heard me. He was in the room next to it with his door shut, poor guy. And so I remember being kind of embarrassed then. And then I just kind of remember, yeah, just working through, not being embarrassed, not caring, doing it in one take. It's okay if you fumble over your words or you mess up or your hair was out of place or whatever. But I remember feeling so awkward and embarrassed when he walked out because I was like, oh my gosh, he heard me. And it's like, well, of course he heard you. The neighbors probably heard you. You redid it so many times and how did I recover? I mean, that's kind of a tough question because I don't feel the need to recover from something like that, but I just remember feeling super awkward in that moment and then probably if you go back and watch all those old videos, you'll be like, oh yeah, Lunden was super awkward then too.

Aubrie Pohl: 8:57

What did you recover? In what way did you recover from the need to do 50 retakes, because that's a whole wormhole in itself. I remember I was making videos at home, too, with one of my roommates, jilly, and then she comes out and she's like that's so good. I'm like, yeah, I need to do it again though. And she's like what? Like yeah, I need to record it again. So I have other takes and she looks at me and she's like don't record it again. Why would you do that? You just did it. You did it fine and great, and it's as if it didn't come in my brain that I could be okay with one take or just three, you know, and she's the best of three. So I had that thing in my brain too, where it's like no, I didn't pronounce this one sentence in this one way, with that one intonation that goes up and it can sound even better. But that's that fight for perfection almost in our brain. So how'd you recover from that?

Lunden Souza: 9:46

How did I recover from? I'm not really sure if there was a moment that I remember switching or, like you mentioned, like how you just decided you weren't going to be embarrassed anymore. I think I just had so many repetitions under my belt that maybe I did math. I was like, okay, one video times, 50 takes times, however many videos I needed to do per week. And then you're like ain't, nobody got time for that, and you know what I stopped doing too. I stopped watching it. Afterwards I stopped.

Lunden Souza: 10:16

Even now when I record podcasts, I don't go back and listen to it. Then, before I publish it, if I know there's something that needs to be edited, which is very few and far between, like if there was a disconnect or a hiccup. Or I was interviewing this mom a few months ago and she had to take a pause break because her child had to go to the bathroom. So she's like pause, I'm going to go take my kid to the bathroom, I'll be right back. So I had to edit out some things in there, but for the most part I just put it out there and give a little less fucks. In fact, I remember this is interesting that this memory came to mind Jade's ex-wife Jill.

Lunden Souza: 10:55

Before I met Jade, anything me and my mom went to one of her retreats in Venice Beach in 2013. And I remember her and I took a picture together and then I was like, oh, do you like it? And she goes, oh, just post it. That's my new thing. I don't even look at pictures anymore. I say, just post it. And I remember thinking cool. And then I remember thinking like, oh, how do you do? Like you just let someone post a picture that you haven't seen yet. You know, and I know that that was maybe her thing of like, okay, I'm just going to not care. And by, you know, just letting people post, just post it, fuck it, post it. Who cares if there's something in my teeth or it wasn't my best smile or whatever? So I think that's maybe what I was feeling too is just kind of like, oh, just record it and post it, record it and post it.

Lunden Souza: 11:46

And I think that's kind of how I got beyond it. I think now I don't yeah, I don't. I remember caring and now I remember not caring, but I don't remember that shift of like oh, today I decided I'm no longer going to be embarrassed. But also, you know, I had in the beginning of a lot of these videos and creation and stuff I was battling and you know, or working with, let's say, working to move out very bad cystic acne, so I also was like making sure that the lighting was okay, my makeup was good, you know. So there was a lot of like physical insecurity. That, I think, was also coupled with a lot of like what was I saying? Does it sound stupid? Anyways, I don't remember how I recovered, but I think I'm recovered now.

Aubrie Pohl: 12:27

That sounds like a great recovery.

Lunden Souza: 12:34

Oh, but wait, wait. At our first Voice of Impact seminar, remember how nervous I was and I was like I was. I didn't even remember what I said. I was embarrassed. I think Maybe that was embarrassment, maybe that was just nervous. But I, this second one we've done, I felt great and I've spoken on so many stages. I just think it was a new arena for me, like a new way of engaging. And you asked me you go, what's the difference between? You said this. I just remembered you were like what's the difference between you talking on a podcast and you talking in front of on? And I was like, oh, people, and isn't it wild that I can coach on communication with you? Have a podcast, talk in front of people, thousands of people, even at some points in my life and career, and then me still be like, oh, but there were people there. That was scary.

Aubrie Pohl: 13:17

Yeah, my Instagram, one of my Instagram posts last week. It's scary because it's new, not because you're incapable. It's scary because it's new, not because you're incapable. It's scary because it's different, not because you're incapable. And that is all full circle about this masterclass communicate with confidence, because this is all putting yourself in those new arenas so that you can feel more comfortable.

Aubrie Pohl: 13:39

And I had the opportunity to make a talk about confidence last month and my favorite blip of the whole talk is don't wait until you're confident to show up. Show up until you're confident. And I couldn't agree to that more, because the more that we put ourselves in these situations to talk in front of people or podcasts and show our skills and just share the information that we want to share, the more that we have the opportunity to step into that confidence. Because really, a lot of it just stems from these insecurities that we have for no rhyme or reason, just a programming that we created when we were younger. And when we grow out of those programmings we see, oh, it's weird, why was I so insecure? Well, I had reasons to be insecure in the moment and it still stems from an underlying insecurity where that is the thing to work on, and so it's easy to communicate with confidence after you move through those areas of resistance and awareness that you need to have.

Lunden Souza: 14:33

Love it. What is your most awkward thing you've ever said in public? Do you know?

Aubrie Pohl: 14:39

I don't know, like I don't know if it's awkward, it's just stuff that you say when you're speaking in front of people. And I've had multiple times where I meant to say and talk about one thing and I talked about something maybe inappropriate or off-kiltered and some of the room knew what I meant, some of the room didn't know what I meant and it was just this moment of like oh, we're not all on the same page. And to recover that from that as a speaker, the first thing is that perception is projection. So if I'm starting to get nervous and spin on that, I said something quote, unquote, wrong or not, okay, then everyone's going to read that in the room. But if I make sure that, even if I say something off or off kilter or doesn't belong in that moment, if I just keep it light and breezy, other people will too. If I just keep it light and breezy, other people will too.

Aubrie Pohl: 15:27

So that's what I have in my head is like light and breezy. Light and breezy because the more that I can perceive that within my own life, the more that I can project that and then give other people opportunity to project that too, cause we're all going to mess up the more that you talk out loud, the more likely you're going to mess up, because you're doing it more often. And so I would say those are the most awkward moments, for sure. And then one time, one time, uh, I was talking to someone and he's like yeah, you're kind of awkward, but it's cute. I was like, okay, it's cute. Okay, I can be awkward. And it was like this permission that even if it is awkward, it's cute, it's fine.

Lunden Souza: 16:06

Right, and I guess I should say too, we, I, I, I asked chat GPT for these questions. So when she asked us when chat GPT, she's a she and my model of the world when she asked us these questions and I was reading through some of them too, I was kind of like, okay, well, what is awkward? Can awkward be like a good, you know, and there's like quirkiness to awkward and I kind of, you know, and it's what you know, when things are like too polished or too perfect, then you don't like resonate as much. So I think if someone told me I was awkward but cute, I would take it as a compliment too, just like you did.

Aubrie Pohl: 16:32

Yeah, I loved it.

Lunden Souza: 16:33

I was like let's see what's another. What's the next question? Okay, this is cool. Can you share a moment when you weren't confident but had to fake it, and what did you learn from that experience?

Aubrie Pohl: 16:52

Oh, my goodness, I would say the first, the beginning. What I get sent back to in my brain is when I worked at Innovative Results, which was a gym and I was helping run it I was one of the lead trainers was a gym and I was helping run it. I was one of the lead trainers and my boss had been stepping into moments in time where he would make like a five minute speech before class just about your mind, your body, your wellness, the way that you move, and then we would go into the workout. So I was like, oh, if he's, if he's doing that, maybe I can too. So I would take those moments and I would start talking about, you know, growth mindset versus fixed mindset.

Aubrie Pohl: 17:22

And I remember being so nervous and not confident and scared, and I faked it, you know, and it's fake it till you make it, believe it, until you become it, feel it, until you reel it. But I remember in my brain saying, oh, my God, I'm scared to do this, holy crap. Okay, but just do it. I'll be, just do it. Just do it. You can just start the workout, though you don't have to do this whole talk beforehand. No, Aubrie, you've got this, you can do it and I would push myself to that space that I'd be like, all right, everyone gather around.

Aubrie Pohl: 17:50

So there's this thing of growth mindset versus fixed mindset and I started to create that space because I deep down desired to be that person. When I saw other people getting in front of a group and talking with confidence, I was like I want to do that. I don't know why, but my body felt pulled to it. So I did that little battle in my mind, oh, not even a little battle. It's like the cheerleader you have inside of you. That's like go, go, go beyond what you think is comfortable.

Lunden Souza: 18:17

You've got this.

Aubrie Pohl: 18:18

And I still do that to this day, and I think you know, I think a lot of people see me communicate with a lot of confidence and not that it's not real. I'm a very confident individual and that's why it exudes outward and a lot of the time I'm also very insecure. I have a lot of programming within me that has that guidance system of not really of doubt, like self-d doubt, but I'm over that. I'm not doing that anymore and so it's me finding who I want to be with my previous programming and holding space for both, because both can be true. You can communicate with confidence and still have a programming of insecurity. That's there. It's just about. Can you make the decision in your mind to step forth into the person that you really want to be and challenge yourself in that way?

Lunden Souza: 19:09

And so that's what I do now. Yeah, like which one's louder.

Aubrie Pohl: 19:14

Yeah.

Lunden Souza: 19:15

It's like not pretending, like that insecure, nervous part of you isn't there, but then which side's going to like win or which one gets to step on stage. I think that um a moment when I was, wasn't confident and had to fake it. Okay, so for sure, the first VOI, first voice of impact, was not super confident and had to fake it. Also, side note, I had just gotten my hair done the week before and the chick jacked it up and it was bright orange. Don't lie, Aubrie, you told me it was orange, so my hair was orange it was like a time Lunden.

Lunden Souza: 19:52

That's wild though, because I don't know if I've ever had that moment where then I felt like no girl, your hair's orange. And then I also had an opportunity to go speak on stage for two full days. That was. I was not confident, or, as I should say, I was not as confident as I am doing that now, and it was new and I hadn't done a seminar like that ever for two full days. I mean, you were doing it, we did it together, so it wasn't just only me speaking the whole time, but I think the longest talk I had ever done before that was probably like an hour and a half or two hours. Yeah, mostly yeah, the ones that were in person and even on Zoom, just like, yeah, a couple hours, and I'd done retreats and things like that. Anyways, that was a moment when I wasn't super confident and had to just yeah, show up anyway.

Aubrie Pohl: 20:47

Yeah, we just threw you in there and you shined. It was so great.

Lunden Souza: 20:51

We just did it Orange hair and all.

Aubrie Pohl: 20:53

Orange hair and all, and it was fun. You know, I remember just being like this is part of the test. You know, this is part of the experience with you and your hair too, because you know that you're a skilled speaker and you know that your hair doesn't matter in the big scheme of things, and it was still a thing that was there and present and it was still a thing that was there and present.

Lunden Souza: 21:13

It was a thing. It was a thing. And also when I wasn't confident in communication to all probably say most recently was when I took the director position at Brain Balance and I talked to a lot of families like over 60 families a month, and each of those families that I talk with I talk for multiple hours and in the beginning I was just so nervous because I was like, okay, what if they ask me if I have kids and I don't have kids? That was like my biggest fear was like that a parent was going to ask me well, do you have kids? And that happened, by the way. A parent did ask me that in frustration and was like, well, do you have kids?

Lunden Souza: 21:51

Because I work with if you guys don't know what brain balance is, we work with kids who struggle across the board behaviorally, emotionally, socially, academically.

Lunden Souza: 21:59

So, of course, when kids are struggling, the family struggles too, because we love our kids. And so, anyways, I talked to a lot of families for long periods of time and I just remember being so nervous that they were going to think that I didn't know what I was talking about, that who could this girl be that doesn't even have kids. That's telling me that my kid needs whatever program. So that was probably a more recent time last question, or whenever you said it in the beginning of like, yeah, you aren't confident, but then you keep doing it until you are confident, like you work into it, and so I just told myself that okay, you've had previous experiences where you felt awkward and you did it 50 times to make a short little video and now there's real people, so there's no like do-overs and that's okay and just like. So that was a moment that I felt, yeah, not that confident when I think of speaking and communicating and listening and all the stuff that comes with that. So I think that was probably the least confident I felt recently.

Aubrie Pohl: 23:03

Yeah, it's all coming back to the skill sets too, because you're so confident doing podcasts and to me, podcasts are way different. They're actually more of a skill set that I'm developing because, talking in front of people, you've got the feedback, you've got the receptivity of them laughing to your jokes or the moments of humor, and you have it in the moment. Or they even make questions with their face when you know you need to change it to something that makes even more sense. And so you have that. And then podcasts, you, podcasts. You don't? I'm glad right now we have it because we're dueling this podcast and we have that opportunity to get the feedback from one another. But other than that, you're talking into a microphone, so you're learning a lot of new, different skill sets. I like this next question.

Lunden Souza: 23:46

What is it?

Aubrie Pohl: 23:46

What's one communication habit you've changed that has had the biggest impact on your relationships or career?

Lunden Souza: 23:52

I love that you picked that because when I was looking at the list, that's what I was in my head. I was thinking oh, I hope that's the next question. You read my mind. What's one communication habit you've think has been the biggest one? Like holding back the advice tongue of like you should do this. I remember sitting. I wasn't, I didn't. When was this? This was not. I'm trying to think if this was when I moved back for COVID, it doesn't matter either way.

Lunden Souza: 24:37

I was in LA hanging out with my friend Allie and our friend Danielle, and we were all eating food somewhere together, like at this, like deli. I'm just imagining us like we're all sitting somewhere and I remember them talking about how they don't make enough money at their job and I was like okay, well, when's the last time you asked for a raise? And they were like never. And I was like what do you mean? You're supposed to ask for a raise like every six months, are you joking? That's literally probably how it sounds. And I remember seeing their face of like damn girl, you know. And so that's. That's the Lunden that I've graciously laid to rest is just like let people just vent and share when they want to, if they want your advice, they'll probably ask for it. Right, like, what would you do, or what do you think? Or you know, if you were me? Like, just there's so many ways that people know how to ask for feedback if they want it that I just don't have to jump out and give the advice. Even in NLP and in coaching, the best advice oftentimes comes in the form of a question. So just like asking, you know, a question that helps someone you know discover on their own and figure out the answer on their own. So I think that one's been a huge.

Lunden Souza: 25:59

I remember when I was dating Andreas as well. He has type one diabetes and yeah, I just would oftentimes give him so much input, unsolicited advice on, like what he should or shouldn't be eating, or how he should or shouldn't be living his life, and oh, that was probably the worst. Him and I are such great friends now I'll have to ask him how annoying he thought I was then. But I remember when I started to just like not give that advice anymore and then at some point him and I lived together and we just like he saw me like day in and day out, like I wake up, I do this, you know, and it's like, and I remember at one point he was like he wasn't the right word in English. The word that he was looking for was consistent. But he was like I remember he goes you're very consequent. And I was like consequent. And then, anyways, we figured out that the word was not consequent, but consistent.

Lunden Souza: 26:53

And then he started being like okay, I want some of that, like if I would take my apple cider vinegar shot or my supplements or go for a walk, even if it was snowing or rain or whatever you know. And so I just realized, like, just stop telling people what you think they should do and just do yourself, and then, if they want to catch on to something great. And in the midst of also not giving people advice, I'm also learning from other people too. I'm not the glory thing to look at in the room all the time. It's not just like I don't have it all figured out. I don't know why. For some reason I thought that so yeah, that changed. My. Everything is giving advice, I think, unless someone asks for it, or yeah, just not wanting to jump to tell you what I think you know.

Aubrie Pohl: 27:40

I really resonate with that. When I go home to see my parents and my sister and I remember years ago when I first got into health and fitness, like almost 20 years ago, I would go home and I would shove things in their faces and, you know, I'd literally buy organic spinach and be like this is what we're going to eat, whatever. And they didn't have that at that point and I remember still, I would go home and be like you should probably get a squatty potty, because it allow your feet your feet to lift up and it, you know, moves your sacral center in a different position so that you can poop easier. And it was like no, no, no, no. And I come home for this holiday and there's a squatty potty. So it always takes a few years, but eventually, if I'm just being me, that's a lot easier and they don't feel like I'm shoving ideas down their throat. And I learned that and I love that with NLP is just having that confidence to be able to ask really good questions, because that just helps with communication in general and getting to know people better and getting to know what's happening on the inside of their model of the world. What's yours?

Aubrie Pohl: 28:39

I was thinking about this and I want to put it in regards to just like opening up to other people, to letting them know what you're experiencing, or letting them know what I'm experiencing and I think that was the biggest marker was giving myself permission to just share authentically and be really real with people. But that was also very challenging, and now I'm experiencing that in some of the dating scene because you just you really get to be direct, and sometimes being direct is confronting your own insecurities and also just fear of rejection, fear of the response that you're going to get, and you have to really come from a place of wholeness to be able to present information outward. But now I'm working on it. Oh my gosh, it's so funny. So I went on an online dating event two nights ago because I was like you know what? All of a sudden, this came across my eye.

Lunden Souza: 29:32

I don't know this information yet.

Aubrie Pohl: 29:34

I don't, I haven't told you it yet. And so it was an online dating event through Eventbrite and I was like, fuck it, let me just see what happens On Zoom. No, it was just through like their website, and so literally it's like here's this guy coming from this location and I had sent it to Arizona because I'm going to Arizona lately and like that'd be cool if I can meet somebody out there. And it brought up people like actual men onto the online dating and it was speed dating. So, yeah, eight minutes. And it was very nerve wracking for me, but it was like the reason that I did it was you know, maybe I'll meet someone.

Aubrie Pohl: 30:11

Most likely no, because these men were like in their late forties, and but it was fun because I would be like how old are you? And this one guy was like, oh, I'm 45. And I was like, oh, okay, and we talked a little bit more and I was like, to be honest, that's a little above my age bracket for dating. So I'm going to, you know, wish you the best luck. But that kind of communication, oh my gosh, is so new to me. And being that direct with what I'm feeling and what's present in my reality towards a romantic kind of scene and scenario. So it was a really good time for me to practice those skill sets. So that's what I'm working on lately is how to be more direct but also set the boundaries that I need to set.

Lunden Souza: 30:49

I love that Were you in breakout rooms for eight minutes. Is that like? And you'd have one-on-one with the person for eight minutes is actually kind of a long time.

Aubrie Pohl: 30:57

Yeah, it was. It was kind of a long time. You could always end it early if you feel like it, so it gives you the opportunity to cancel. Nobody gets each other's number or information unless you want to after the call.

Lunden Souza: 31:08

It was a pretty cool setup, uh setup given for what it was, and a really good opportunity to practice some good old direct communication, yeah, instead of making up a story about something like oh, I didn't like them, or that was awkward, or they were like, you know, it's like. No, they're just like. They might be great, but, like age wise, that's not where I'm at.

Aubrie Pohl: 31:28

And yeah, that's weird. Right now I can't understand the hang up and pretend that the internet just got weird or something, because I didn't want to, you know did you think about doing that no.

Lunden Souza: 31:42

Well, that sounded very specific.

Aubrie Pohl: 31:46

Oh, the internet's really spotty If it hangs up right now like what I can't hear you. But sometimes we'll do that like because we're scared of communication, so we'll make up some silly white lie in order to not directly communicate. And you know, in the dating scenario or in the past, experiencing ghosting or being too afraid to communicate myself, and therefore ghosting has been something I've been involved in. And so now I'm trying to make that line within myself of like no, you can't ghost either. If you don't like ghosting, you can't ghost either. Aubrie.

Lunden Souza: 32:19

Yeah, no, internet failure ghosting happening here.

Aubrie Pohl: 32:24

Oh, sorry, I didn't get the text or the message. No, it's like you got to be straight up, so that's been fun.

Lunden Souza: 32:31

Yeah, that's it.

Aubrie Pohl: 32:32

I'm so excited to hear more about this, that's super interesting, I know because I get with confidence so much in every aspect of my life, especially when I'm speaking and teaching NLP, and then all of a sudden in the dating world I become like an insecure little girl and I just am working on all of those insecurities. It's been fun.

Lunden Souza: 32:48

That was going to be a question. I take off the script or off. The random list that we had was like okay, you're such a great communicator, where do you get most nervous to communicate? So, dating wise, that's where you feel most nervous.

Aubrie Pohl: 33:01

I can talk to a room of 300 people and be so confident. I can talk to a group of people and it's interesting because a lot of people have a fear of public speaking. But I don't. I don't have a fear of public speaking. The more the merrier, that's great. My fear is one-on-one communication because that's way more vulnerable. In my model of the world, I'm seen way deeper and way more known in one-on-one scenarios than in one versus many than in one versus many.

Lunden Souza: 33:37

Yeah, I remember when we had what did we have at my house?

Aubrie Pohl: 33:39

and you were here visiting Dinner on purpose.

Lunden Souza: 33:40

No, because you weren't here for dinner. No, when we did the walking meditation, remember, and you were visiting and I invited random not even random, but just people I had met throughout the months of being here in Utah and then we all came in and we're like chatting afterwards and you afterwards you were like, did you notice how? I was like in the corner, nervous, and I was like, oh, no, I didn't actually Like I, we were all just. And you were like, oh, but you didn't really. And I was like, no, not because I wasn't paying attention to you, I just felt like you were part of you know, but I, I love that you shared that Cause. That was like that moment where you're probably like in your own head or whatever, in the corner, thinking, oh, I need to engage or not, or whatever.

Lunden Souza: 34:21

But I remember when you shared that with me afterwards I was like, oh, okay, yeah, I get to know more of you, which is great, um, because you rush it in front of people. I remember the first time taking NLP, or actually not even the first time taking your NLP course, but when you spoke at the retreat in Costa Rica, I was mesmerized. I was like, oh shit, I could watch this girl talk for days and hours and I have because I've taken all your certification courses and everything and you're just so captivating. But I think it's great to share because just because you're great on stage with a bunch of people doesn't mean that you feel good one-on-one. So thanks for sharing.

Aubrie Pohl: 34:57

Yeah, it's so interesting too, because then in those moments I'm like okay, what is real, and then what is only in my head. If I thought I was being awkward in the corner and then you said I wasn't, I was like did I just make that up in my brain? Was I being completely normal? Like did people not think that I was being in? It was just in my head stuff. And I think that comes back to, you know, the idea of masking or the roles that we try to play in front of scenarios, and so I was just maybe feeling some underlying pressure that I needed to be a certain way, and then I was just being naturally me and I perceived it as being awkward or different, when it was actually just fine, who knows.

Lunden Souza: 35:35

Right, yeah, I remember that part.

Aubrie Pohl: 35:37

Yeah.

Aubrie Pohl: 35:38

It's so interesting too, when I have those moments and I relate to people that have social anxiety, because I used to identify as somebody with social anxiety. And then I was talking to my friend Gino and I just remember this quote. He was like Aubrie, they're just human. And I'm like, what do you mean? Yeah, but they're people. And he's like, yeah, but they're just like you, Like nobody knows what we're doing, and it was such a release into this relaxation that I can have with people, and so now I try to leave with that kind of emotional center of there is no pressure to be a certain way when you're with other people and actually if you're authentically yourself, you're going to feel better too.

Lunden Souza: 36:14

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, you were talking about that.

Lunden Souza: 36:18

I was thinking too about how, when I moved to Austria and was always on camera and on stage, there were times where I felt like being one on, like coming off the stage, was hard and really having those authentic, true one-on-one conversations, really letting people know who I am.

Lunden Souza: 36:43

And then I think that's why people were like oh my gosh, Lunden, are you just like, always motivated and always happy and always positive and always. I don't think I knew how to like and I think I'm still discovering it too I don't think I knew how to be all parts of me, because we all have not just like the happy, good, good on stage, confident, communicate with confident parts. There's also all the other parts, and I think that when it came time to, yeah, just step off the stage and then be one-on-one or in small groups, there were parts that so badly wanted to be seen, but I didn't know how to let them be seen, because in my head I was thinking like, oh well, if you're not, you know, if you're these things, then you're not these other things, and it's like, actually, you can just be all of the things and just kind of express what feels most right in the moment.

Aubrie Pohl: 37:38

Yeah, definitely.

Aubrie Pohl: 37:38

And you can be the speaker that goes on front of the stage in front of 1100 people in Austria doing an entire workout party with this high energy, and you can be the person that's just more grounded and going through emotional experiences and if you're having a sad day, you can be having a sad day.

Aubrie Pohl: 37:53

And it's almost interesting when we get put on stages because it's as if we have this role that we put forth. It's a little bit of acting, but, to be honest, for me it's like just being the speaker that you want to be. Like, even if I'm having a shitty day, if I'm talking in front of an audience, I'm not going to be so solemn as I would be if I'm by myself. I'm going to use that opportunity to turn it off and be the speaker that I want to be. And so maybe in this way, before we think that we have this perception to uphold because of who we are in front of people on stage, and then we realize that that's just a veil within itself and then we step forward out of that and we can be more real and raw and be more intimate. Settings with people, one-on-one or just a couple of people.

Lunden Souza: 38:39

I think for me, the situations that I, the conversations or the times for communication that get me a little bit nervous and sweaty are conversations with people that have known. We've known each other for a while or at least known each other through different versions of ourselves. And I think I can think of like two people in particular, and we both still want to be in each other's lives and we both know that we are evolving in new ways. And so meeting those old people in a new frame of where I am now and where they're at now, sometimes I get a little awkward and uncomfortable in those situations of like we both know we don't want to talk about the things we used to talk about, but how do we get into the flow of talking about these new ways we want to go? And so oftentimes in those like awkward.

Lunden Souza: 39:50

That's why I love dinner on purpose and the card set that we created. I also love Googling like questions to deepen conversations. I mean, that's what we're doing now is just coming up with a bunch of questions. So in those scenarios with those particular people I usually end up like Googling questions or asking random questions or like it's I get a little nervous, like just going into conversation sometimes with people that I've, that I've, I don't know. Does that make sense, like I've known them for a long time?

Aubrie Pohl: 40:21

Yes, Because there's a belief that making friends as an adult is hard. There's this societal belief I've heard you know, my parents say it, I've heard a lot of my friends say it that making friends as an adult is hard. So there's this thing that we get to do now and hold space for the moments where that belief could be present, Because it is interesting to make friends and be like hi, I like you, Do you want to be friends? Do you want to hang out with me? Should we do this thing and then cultivate conversation from there, so growing the relationship? And then how.

Aubrie Pohl: 40:53

You also mentioned the friendships that we've had for years. And when we change so much as an individual, sometimes when we go back to those people we haven't seen in a good amount of time, we are different, like fundamentally different, and so how do we present ourselves while also communicating that we're different than we used to be? And there's a lot of these underlying medic communications that can happen. I really enjoy the belief system that my friends you know this one group of friends that I have in like 2017, we made this decision of like who. Every time you talk to somebody, allow them to be who they are in that moment, and so, even if you haven't seen somebody for a year, remember who they are and also don't hold them to that who they used to be, because they could have made so many changes in the last year.

Aubrie Pohl: 41:49

So it was just kind of like okay, who are you today, Lunden? I'm so grateful to be friends with you for this long now, and today you could be an entirely different person. So now I'm holding space to get to know Lunden as you are in this moment.

Lunden Souza: 42:03

Totally and you're not one of the people I was thinking of, because I feel like whatever version I am in that day is I. For some reason I don't get nervous or sweaty or uncomfortable around that. But and then I don't think making friends as an adult is hard, because I've made a lot of friends, but it's like they only know this version of me which feels very good and authentic, you know. And then I think sometimes, when I'm around people being this version of me that have known me and I don't know, sometimes I get a little bit like I don't know, like, am I be? I don't, it's, it's super wild. I don't know. I don't even know how to fully describe what that feeling is, but it's like. It's almost like wait, am I, am I being true to myself myself now or am I being the version before? Is there a both? And that can kind of dance together, because I have known this person since I was 10 years old. You know what I mean. There's a little bit of like yeah, it is kind of making friends. It's like re-being on the playground again, but I don't feel that with new people that I just met or whatever, but the people that have been on the journey of Lunden. I feel that way with. Sometimes there's a couple of people that I can think of where I'm like, yeah, I don't know.

Lunden Souza: 43:18

Or I remember, like, um, when I first started going to retreats, and ones that I would say are more spiritual, um, and internal, internally inquisitive in nature, and just about you know just those types of retreats, and I remember thinking like, oh, my gosh, I'm not deep enough, I don't know. I remember one time being at a retreat in Scotland and one of the guys was sort of asking people just like, oh yeah, what's your favorite mantra? Like, just like how, let's say, everyday, people might be like, oh, what's your favorite baseball team, you know. And I remember like we were hiking and I like took a few steps. I remember thinking I don't know what my favorite is and I don't want him to ask me, and I don't feel like deep enough or you know like, but I knew I wanted to be there, I knew I was craving growth, I knew I was craving something different. So now when I'm in those moments, I often think of that moment of like, oh yeah, but remember when you first started going to retreats and you were by yourself and you didn't know anyone and you knew you wanted to dive deeper into the essence of you and your spirituality and just healing through different plant medicines and different things that your friends and your family for sure weren't doing.

Lunden Souza: 44:27

But that's also sometimes like in business or entrepreneurship or, yeah, in other groups of leaders. I feel that way too, where I get a little nervous, where I'm like I don't know if I'm good enough to be here. But I think that's the whole point. I think that you have to put yourself in those arenas where you're like scared and you do it anyway, or you're nervous and you feel small, but you're going to show up confident anyways. So those are some arenas where I feel a little bit. That doesn't mean I'm not going to go there, it doesn't mean I'm not going to have the conversation or I'm not going to go to that room just because I'm not confident, but just for the sake of being like super real and honest in now of what I'm thinking of. I'm like, oh yeah, those are still some moments that kind of like a little nervous.

Aubrie Pohl: 45:11

Yeah, and you put yourself in those moments in life too. You what's that saying about putting on the bigger shoes until you grow into them, kind of way of thinking. You know, say, say yes now, figure out later. And it's this underlying character and personality trait that we have, that to be able to step into those moments. The other quote you know, if you're the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room, like you get to put yourself in rooms where people are smarter, bigger, faster, stronger, whatever it is, because then you get to, you get to up level and you get to grow and you put yourself in those places to be able to make that change happen.

Aubrie Pohl: 45:46

And it can be a little unnerving, like figuring out your favorite mantra. You know, you got to feel into all the different mantras and if you don't know that many mantras or you don't know if you want to do one, that's like the Sanskrit language. You don't know the Sanskrit and things like that can be nerve wracking. And then you realize that, oh, again, that's just insecurities coming up and you can just say anything and it's all going to be okay. There's no wrong answers.

Lunden Souza: 46:09

And no one yes, and no one like remembers what you said. You know, I think that's just something we can kind of like a topic we can sort of land the plane with is like no, everyone's so. In their own world, own processing, you know, filters, their model that, like I have friends and even clients who are to use the word that you introduced me to that I love that are ruminating in like something that they said years ago that they're still like embarrassed about or nervous. It's like nobody remembers what you said. You guys listening to this podcast now, once it's over, you might remember a few things that stood out to you or spoke to you, but you're not going to remember like, oh, Lunden said um too many times or that was weird that she shared that about that one Like nobody cares, like they don't, like they just don't.

Aubrie Pohl: 47:12

So freeing too and that is full circle to communicate with confidence. It's the ability and it's like becoming who you want to be and who you are is not necessarily about becoming. It's also about unbecoming who you aren't and shedding the layers and the overthinkers. People pleasers, perfectionism A lot of that often involves shedding the perception that you think you need to be and then letting go of that to just be what's already there and who you truly are. And from that space can come a lot of the confidence and ability to speak without just being hard on yourself or self-sabotaging yourself in any way. It's really a let go to come into the confidence that you have within.

Lunden Souza: 48:00

There's a paper that I wrote on my fridge and it says nobody cares. You're going to die. It's time, and that's also what it makes me think of, because it's like nobody cares you're going to die. It's time, and that's also what it makes me think of, because it's like nobody cares or nobody's making it out of this world alive. It's time to communicate, it's time to share, it's time to mess up.

Lunden Souza: 48:19

It's time to go to the online speed dating events. It's time to go to the seminar. It's time to go to the masterclass. It's time to be nervous and do it anyway. It's time to have that hard conversation and mess up and do it over.

Lunden Souza: 48:34

It's just time to do all the things that freak you out and you're scared and make you nervous, and public speaking and even just communicating and having those hard conversations and communicating in front of people is like a bigger the top fear next to dying. So it's like might as well put them, you know, together and be like oh yeah, you know you're not going to make it out of here alive. It's time to just show up and be in front of people. But that's why I'm so passionate about communication and public speaking, and the coaching that you and I do is because I know it's one of the top fears and I just think, being scared and doing it anyway, you get so much cool stuff out of life I think, yeah, and the fear of being seen is real for people too, the fear of being exposed to the world.

Aubrie Pohl: 49:30

Being exposed to the world, and a lot of it can stem from having you know, guidance, parental guidance, or people that are guardians that watch after us that didn't receive our feelings, didn't receive who we were, and so we're afraid to show ourselves now and all of that is just a bunch of hooey, like you can throw all of that out and you can let yourself be seen, heard, known, right to be loved is to be known by people, and you get to let people know who you are, and so to be able to hold a masterclass or a safe space so that people can learn the skill sets of releasing who you aren't and who you're not meant to be, so that you can be who you are confidently and communicate with that confidence. I feel so grateful to be on this journey, to have that information to present to people and also to have the experience of it, to get to the space that I'm in, to be able to share.

Lunden Souza: 50:16

Yeah, you're the best. I love talking with you. I could talk to you for hours and I get to. I get to all the time. Um, thank you for for being here and for sharing and for all the things and for you guys listening.

Lunden Souza: 50:29

We want to see your beautiful face on camera with us at our communicate with confidence masterclass on January 11th. Um, I'll put the link in the description. Wherever you're watching this video clip or listening to this audio, you'll you'll see that link, but it's lifelikelunden. com/CWC communicate with confidence CWC. And you can sign up there. It's absolutely free. You'll have a two-hour seminar or a two-hour masterclass to help you unlock some really important keys to expressing yourself, not only on stage, in front of people, public speaking yes, that's part of it and it's huge and we love that piece but then also offstage, right Interpersonally, those one-on-one conversations with our family, with our partners, with our friends, those, yeah, those really powerful, potent, like nitty gritty conversations that we get to have on the day to day. And then, of course, if you want to speak and be on stage and share your story and just start to unleash more of that, you're going to get all of that in our masterclass. I'm excited to host that with you.

Aubrie Pohl: 51:42

Yes, your words are the gateway to your needs being met. So the more that we can have this authentic, free-flowing channel of energy from our throat. That's our manifestation point, as well as coming out of our throat and expressing and externalizing our inner reality to the people around us, or just to our reality. It's so fun and this is going to be a great masterclass. So come join us. Come join us so we can have this time to hang, uh, hang out, be free and speak freely, because we all deserve that.

Lunden Souza: 52:14

Yeah, we do Feels good. Love you, Aubs. Thanks for being here, appreciate you.

Aubrie Pohl: 52:19

I'll talk to you soon.

Lunden Souza: 52:20

Thank you, guys, for listening. See you at the next episode.

Lunden Souza: 52:23

Bye, bye thank you so much for listening to this episode of Self Love and Sweat the podcast. If you enjoyed this episode or were inspired by it or something resonated with you, do me a favor and share this episode with a friend, someone that you think might enjoy this episode as well. That's the ultimate compliment and the best way to make this podcast ripple out into the world of others, and also you can leave us a review up to five stars wherever you're listening to the podcast. Thank you so much for listening and we'll see you at the next episode. I appreciate you.